Richard Toscan's Lounge Discussions

Dan. No worries. Glad I still have the energy to occasionally leap to anything. And as for talking about two different things - I frequently do that to myself in the mirror - so nice to have someone who actually replies and doesn't stare back at me in need of a shave.

@ Michael. I've never heard the over 40 thing about writers for Hollywood, however it would seem to make sense. The largest ticket buying audience is the 15 to 25 year old group, or at least that's what I've read. So mature writing doesn't appeal to them, or maybe that's just what Hollywood thinks. Of course, this could be a whole new thread and a new topic to consider.

Dain: Yeah, the "grey listing" has been around a long time. I was aware of it when I was starting out after college, but not worrying at the time because 40 seemed a long ways off - and I only had "making it" on my mind. The crazy thing about it is that writers who are able to establish themselves and make a living at it - know a helluva lot more at 40+ than they did as young pups fresh out of film school or the like. They've been doing it a while. They become better editors of their own work and less enamored of every word they commit to the page. I know that in my career - I started out thinking that a mason should be brought in as soon as I completed my first draft - and commence to chiseling my masterpiece into stone. Now - I can maintain an objective distance and do right by the story and listen to the notes without getting aggravated at the short-sightedness of the giver. Also - as you mentioned with the demographics - in TV and film - the studios/networks still seem to cater to younger skewing audiences - and post 40 writers have and have raised children of their own - who are IN those target demographics - and are living under the same roof as sounding boards and idea machines for their writer parents. (The writer of "HOOK" got the idea from a dinner table conversation with his child). So to dismiss them because of a # is downright idiotic on the behalf of the studios. The grey listing also applies to agents as well - who were refusing to take on clients over 40 - either established writers trying to change reps - or older writers trying to break in. After many attempts to do something about the problem via the WGA - a law firm took on the case as a class action - representing TV writers (although for some reason - not feature writers - to whom it happens as much if not more). They went after all the major studios, TV networks, agencies (large and small) and after a protracted 10 year battle - reached an out of court settlement with most. Some - like CAA - one of the largest agencies in the business and as egregious in this nonsense as any - refused to go along with the settlement and did not contribute to the pool of money. Also, as part of the settlement - an agreement was reached (which is monitored I believe and streamlined for those to bring actions against entities thought to still be grey-listing) monetarily and also a system was set up to present opportunities for over 40 writers to be able to pursue work both in TV and film. A sort of Writer Access program. I'm not sure how well any of it is working - but I think any studio caught still actively shutting out over 40 writers will put themselves in a very bad way post-settlement.

@Michael. Sounds like you were in the trenches and maybe picked up a few battle scars along the way. But I take heart in knowing that, the majority of Americans are aging and will pull a larger influence on the quality of what's being produced. Only an aged writer can write from experience.

Dain: Too true. At least I also picked up some union health insurance to make sure the scars heal properly. Young writers have experience too - just not as much.

PS: How could I forget TIME LAPSE? Saw it at a festival last year and the cowriter director took my class ages ago! 3 main characters, mostly in one room, and a trippy time travel story! http://www.scriptmag.com/features/sci-fi-circuit-good-script-opens-many-...

Watch Buried with Ryan Reynolds. the whole movie takes place inside a coffin. And the writer uses clever ways to insert the action.

I liked Quarantine and Rec. I think you can find both on simplyscripts or on mymoviescripts.

Panic Room and the first Saw film are quite good, both those scripts are readily available.

Anyone kind enough to send along PDFs? I've been searching and can't find any of these screenplays on the interwebs.

Sounds great, Fiona and Serita. You never stop learning; evolving as a writer. :)

The initial question is quite vague which leads me to question the writer’s skill level (perhaps the intent was to stimulate some discussion – I don’t know.) What I find interesting is the number of you who recommend “Save the Cat “as the be all universal remedy. Blake & I attended a conference in Anaheim some tears back and over lunch we talked of his then new book. My concern was that he was establishing a one size fits all formula that would become some holy blueprint to be blindly adhered to by industry upstarts. He assured me that it was only a guideline for the creative types. He intended to correct that in his “The Cat Strikes Back “book; but unfortunately, we lost him too soon. Blake was a wondrously generous person.

I don't know what the hell is going on with this thread, but it's Friday, and I wanna play! To answer the question: Writing is easy. All the words are in the dictionary. All we gotta do is pick out which ones we want and put 'em in the right order. That's all - nothin' to it! Happy freakin' Friday!

Jeremy, your question was vague. There are literally thousands of pieces to the puzzle of writing a spec script (screenplay). Thousands! Any specific question you have can be found doing your research on Google or any of the hundreds of writing websites you can easily find. I believe there are no bad questions and you have many answers here on this thread. If you have a burning desire to write something you believe will have value and meaning to an audience, my advice, is follow your bliss. Read books, study like crazy, take on line classes, do anything you can do to fulfill your dream. As for anyone else on this thread that might get their feelings hurt in any way by a couple of 'blunt' answers, well . . . what in the heck do you think is going to happen when you finally get to 'town' ? Hollywood, that is.

You come up with a great idea, characters, plotline, dialogue - then you pick up a pen and a notebook - or buy Final Draft - and you write it.

This is all such great information - thank you so much for everyone giving input! I'll definitely make sure to check out some of these recommendations as I continue my travels! For me, when in LA the coffeeshop on the LMU campus is an amazing place to write (weird but it's worth it). When in DC, I enjoyed working at The Coup in Columbia Heights. Very eccentric cafe that serves coffee AND alcohol - I was there all day! When in Ireland, I quite enjoy any of the pubs in Galway during the day (As long as you can work while tipsy), and in Dublin, well, there's no chance of getting any work done if you're out in public. @eoin I did quite enjoy this 2 story place up the road from Temple Bar Pub, down the alley across from a vintage store I believe? Maybe you can help me out? In New Zealand, the cafes in Britomart area of Auckland were a favorite of mine. Or Chapel Bar in Ponsonby. In Australia.....we'll I never really got any work done in Australia ;) Can give fantastic recommendations on where to go out drinking though!

Cherie, how about Mario's at Brunswick street, Fitzroy, or any coffee shop along that street, but I like mario's for breakfast as well as writing.

@Shannon The Button Factory perhaps?

Scotch on the rocks on my desk with my 27" iMac. The only place for me to write!

Yeah, David, but remember that I will pick you up! Then you dictate it to me while I take a coffee and you have your Scotch... so you could write your script in a coffee shop as well - only if you like and if your wife agrees, of course. :)

One of my favorite examples of foreshadowing is in Shawshank Redemption when the warden says to Andy Dufresne, regarding the Bible, "salvation lies within". He has no idea;)

Foreshadowing is a device in which a writer/filmmaker hints at things to come; possible outcomes within a narrative. It's also used to create intrigue as well as avoid audience disappointment. Often characters will give some sort of prediction or perhaps a premonition, such as in Game of Thrones, "Winter is coming." Or, foreshadowing may appear in imagery or action, such as storm clouds forming on the horizon giving the hint that something bad is about to happen. :)

Another way to look at this: foreshadowing is the laying of hints or clues to the eventual climax of the story so that readers and audiences come away thinking it all makes sense when it's over. It creates an internal logic. So, too much foreshadowing allows us to predict the end and usually become bored with the story. Too little, and you end up with shock at the ending -- though that may make perfect sense for the story you're telling.

This kind of thing has happened to me many times. Everything from an idea of what to put in an empty retail store to oatmeal in Styrofoam cups. Look at it this way - you have a creative mind that knows what other people want or like. It confirms that your idea wasn't out in left field, that someone else thought enough of it to take a chance. That's a good thing, although don't you wish you had gotten there first? Recently happened to me with script I'm working on right now, but doesn't stop me from finishing it. It means I'm in the right ball park and someone might want to play ball. Take it as a compliment and keep going.

That has recently happened to me. Stick to it. If you really think your characters or story is worth writing, continue writing it. If you are really concerned about it being very close, you can either shelf it, keep it as it is, or re-write the things that may make it less like the film that has been released. But don't let it get you down. Original thought is very rarely that, and it is one thing that can keep people from writing.

Oh, yeah it's happened to me more than once. It's called "THE SPECTER OF SIMILAR IDEAS." Check out my article on my blog about his harsh reality: https://scriptcat.wordpress.com/2012/04/06/the-specter-of-similar-ideas/

Don't take it personally. In fact - use it as motivation. A sort of psychic pat on the back. If you keep coming up with ideas that Hollywood is making - then you're on the right track and thinking commercially. Just get more sleep and come up with the ideas a bit quicker. The business has a habit of finding things in the ozone all at the same time - so you end up with 3 movies about farmers suffering through floods or 3 with kids transferring into the Dad's bodies. Usually the first one before the camera gets made - and the rest fade away. But don't give up. It's been said that there are only a half a dozen original plots - and everything else is the original spin you put on something. Different seasoning. West Side Story is Romeo & Juliet set to music and a gang background. That sort of thing. I had a teacher in film school who claimed that a very famous scene from a very famous movie was ripped off from one of his scripts. He wasn't mad about it - he said he was flattered - and it told him that he was on the right track. If they were stealing from him - he was doing it right. That would NOT apply to getting a whole screenplay ripped off - but you get the gist.

The good news is: you are writing what they are making. The better news is: you now know what their version is, so that you can rewrite yours to be unique. Have you ever noticed that there are 2 movies made about volcanoes, 2 movies made about cut talking bugs, 2 movies made about outbreaks, 2 movies made about.... Your script could be the second one. Actually, there was only 1 movie made about outbreaks because CRISIS IN THE HOT ZONE (the first sale with that story) lost its star and crashed and burned and the 2 version OUTBREAK was the only one they made. Yours could be the one that makes it to the screen, too!

Steven & Lisa: that is the romance of being a screenwriter. All of the cool things you can afford now!

Livin' the dream! ;-)

Over the forty years I have been writing screenplays - I have generally stumbled from feast to famine - with long periods wandering around the wilderness nibbling on grasshoppers. And they weren't even honey grasshoppers! I chose to become a lecturer - because initially it gave me the time to be a writer. Unfortunately in recent years teaching has become a nightmare of time consuming paperwork - so that steady income and time to write will be increasingly denied to future young writers. Which is sad. Once upon a time schools were often filled with part time artists and poets and writers and that creative love - from sometimes rather eccentric people inspired wonderful creativity. But I have noticed that over the last decade or so - those individuals have gradually disappeared out of teaching.

Hell - if you paid any attention to reality you would never be a writer. Bugger reality - hammer that keyboard Boomer and get those stories off your chest and onto a bundle of pages held together by two brass clips.

Thanks for the post William!

Magical Realism is used as a genre, but it's also often used as an excuse for poorly plotted stuff or things that just don't make any sense. So it can be a two edged sword.

It's often used in magic set in urban locations to differentiate from fantasies that are more often thought of as lord of the rings type stories.

It's both a genre and a description that can be added... Defintion from Mirriam Webster dictionary - a literary genre or style associated especially with Latin America that incorporates fantastic or mythical elements into otherwise realistic fiction —called also magical realism. — magic realist noun. So I've heard Beasts of the Southern Wild described as a Drama with elements of magical realism, also heard it called magical realism in totality,

And not to be confused with the "magical realism" of the great novelist Gabriel García Márquez and his Latin American contemporaries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel_Garc%C3%ADa_M%C3%A1rquez#Realism_an...

Hi Bill, in my experience, magical realism is typically discussed as a subgenre within a larger overall genre(s), and it can be an element utilized within a screenplay.

Bill, An interesting and insightful article - thanks so much for sharing!

A fine explanation of how the world of a screenplay can be developed.

And today my ACT TWO Blue Book is #1 on Amazon! I'm outselling the Cat! http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BF7WSNO/secretsofactions

And deservedly so! I couldn't buy your last book because I didn't have a Kindle, but now that apps are available for free on phones and tablets, there's not a good enough excuse for anyone to not buy this.

At some point, a good subplot needs to hook back into the main story and help drive that story forward. A subplot that never connects to the main story, even if it shares a character from that main story, is a distraction for audiences; in a sense you're suddenly asking them to watch two different films at the same time.

A subplot is part of the main plot, and subordinate to the main plot.

Generally speaking, I advise that in feature films (not series), subplots are only narratively relevant when they impact the protagonist. Subplots don't have to "revolve around" the central character, but they should impact the protagonist.

Any advice as far as writing goes? I've been screenwriting since I finished film school in 2006. Should I market my own screenplays or find an agent? Find a script doctor? Give it to others that I know will give me honest feedback?

Thanks for the aforementioned advice from above!

Wait a moment... You ask for a 'how' and then tell us you you finished a film school almost 10 years ago and are writing screenplays ever since? Ehhh? Then, you suddenly are looking for an agent or contact for selling your screenplays. What the heck did you learn during the years on your film school? Sorry, I don't want to hurt or insult you or anybody and I usually take each thread here very serious, but this sounds too strange even for me.

I've not sold anything for money and nothing I've done has been published so I'm still a beginner until I sell a script right?

You should have learned that at your film school is the point. Check craigslist and google, offer your scripts at films schools for students etc. and be aware that you have to do some unpaid projects to get your screenplays filmed finally.

I think Stage32 offers seminars on this - or perhaps just verbal pitches(?). Check the Happy Writers tab upper right.

District 9 started as a short too.

Thanks for the insight guys… Rebel Without a Crew is a great read, Jeremy!

The people who did Beasts of the Southern Wild did a short film before that and were approached by a backer who would support whatever they decided to do next. That's like a one in a million thing that happened but it is proof that it can happen.

Is it possible that one successful short make that producers want to know what you have for feature movies? Sorry for my bad English!

Possible yes, but don't hinge your entire career on it. It's who you know way, way more than what you know in this business.

I think passive characters are okay, if at some point they turn active. So it's not so much the passivity or proactivity, but the process of turning.

How to make passive characters more interesting - remember that everyone is the protagonist in their own story. If they side with the main character, it isn't a problem as long as they have a reason for siding with the main character that is more than just 'he/she is their friend' and there are also some characters or other obstacles that the main character is going to face - otherwise you don't have a good story.

Narrative storytelling is all about conflict. A good method to use is to make supporting characters obstacles that are in the way of your main character trying to fulfill their dramatic need. You can tell a lot about a character by how they react to outside stimulus. Winter's Bone is an excellent example to use as a model.

Can you name some passive supporting characters in movies/TV shows that you think work well? "Orphan Black" was awesome this week, so I'll look there...nope! no passive characters! Every character initiates subplots, and that keeps the show exciting. If anyone just said, "You're doing great, Sarah! I support you," they might become redundant. If they just took orders from the main character, they'd become like robots. How do you see a passive supporting character enhancing a story? Even if they work well passive, if they became more active, can you imagine that improving the story even more? Or would that detract?

I am currently writing a screenplay with a somewhat passive main character, which is available to read off of my profile if anyone is interested. It's a bit akin to "The Great Gatsby" in that the main character acts mostly as an observed and supported of the Protagonist and helps the audience to mourn the Protagonist's passing. This can be a useful trick in stores where the protagonist dies, which doesn't happen to often in most screenplays.

I'm kind of upset that we couldn't update a draft... haha I wrote a better draft right after I submitted and kicked myself for jumping the gun.

Unfortunately, that's the standard deal with nearly all screenplay competitions at least in the US -- no updates accepted.

Well there's some that allow you to resubmit after feedback. I like those and look out for them.

Don't want to do the wet blanket thing, but if your scifi novels have been selling well, would you really want to get tangled up with a "screenwriter" who seems to have never written a screenplay, but just treatments? I'd move slowly on this and be sure as Emi mentions that you have an easy out if he doesn't really know how to adapt a novel to a screenplay at this stage of his development.

This is something I am interested in taking on when I have completed my original screenplay. I believe it is a lot harder to write an original than it is to write an adaption. But of course, it has to be to the original writers satisfaction for it to work. As has been mentioned, there's always ways to cover yourself. Good luck, I hope it works well for you.

Last year I got taken to small claims court due to a "writing partner" who wanted a full refund... so, as the judge told me as he dismissed her case, "Next time, make sure to have a lawyer write up any future contracts (since mine was "vague")." Yet, I never expected a "partner" to even go there. But it happened... so learn from my experience.

Another thing I'd like to mention is that a lot of people have wanted to co-write with me, but when it really turns to work, many newbie writers get bogged down and don't know how to... or don't want to do the work to finish. Just sayin'...

Totally agree with that statement. Couldn't have put it better myself.

Robert, first, congrats on awards! You probably want to clarify with the author if she want to pay to commission a script (i.e. pay a WGA or non-WGA writer fee for the writer to adapt the book), if she's trying to sell/option the book to a financier who will develop it, or if she's going to grant a writer a free option and ask him to adapt the book on spec. Writers, it can be tricky to adapt a book if you don't own the rights because when/if the rights revert back to the author, you may have a script you can't sell (because you only own the script, not the underlying rights).

I wouldn't have used the word "tricky", I'd have used the word "illegal".

Good catch. Sorry to be clear, in this scenario, we assume that Author Ricot owns the media rights to her book. The original poster Robert has told us that Ricot "wants" a Screenwriter to adapt her book, so let's say she sets out to create a scenario in which she either commissions a script or gives/shares media rights with a Screenwriter who adapts on spec. To this end, Ricot therefore agrees to let Screenwriter John Doe adapt her book. In addition, they might agree to jointly control the script and media rights for a finite Term, or she might option the book to John Doe. When the Term expires, Ricot will continue to own her book rights, and John Doe will be left with a script that he may solely own or jointly own with Ricot, but he cannot sell his script because his rights to the underlying book have expired. He must reacquire the book rights (or convince Ricot to partner up with him again in one form or another) in order to complete a sale of his script. Thus, many agents advise writers not to adapt on spec if they will not control the underlying rights indefinitely.

@Dan - Wow, if a writer is allowed to personally check for clear chain of title, then it certainly can't hurt! I'd never heard of a writer doing it personally. Super impressive.

@Dan, Oy, at least you were compensated for 2 of them!

Just some suggestions to get you started -- assuming I'm understanding what they're asking for. I think they may want what's called an author's statement about your own motivations as opposed to what you were trying to do with your TV series. Go back and look at the context of the request in the guidelines they've given you for this phase of the competition to see if it's supposed to be your intent with this specific series or your intent more generally as a writer. If it's about you as a writer: Talk about the subjects you like to write about and why you think you're attracted to them, your motivation as a writer, the themes (basic social or political or cultural concerns) you try to address in your work, and what you plan to write over the next year or so.

Email Joey (stage32 boss). He might have advice?

I am not sure if it is a directors statement they simply said it was a note of intent talking about the series as a whole. But thank you for the advice so far it has been helpful

About 5 pages. Might go a little over, but that shouldn't be an issue. Letting the shorts flow huh? That's a good tip.

Good luck! As they say well begun is half done!

A lot of my shorts are around the 5 page mark and the first one that I sold took two and a half hours from inception to finished draft. I just think outlining or writing a treatment for a short of that length is almost counterproductive. Good luck to you Aaron but if you have the idea in your head, just sit down and write it and see how it unfolds. You shouldn't go too far wrong in 5 pages.

If it's only five pages long, skip the treatment and write the short.

Good luck with it Aaron, and as Pierre and Tony have said... you can normally skip the treatment for a short, as many do myself included, but we all have our different methods so go with what you find works best for you ;-) Check out SimplyScripts when you've finished it, they have a very healthy Short script section over there where people post scripts, get feedback, option and sell their scripts... etc, think i've optioned/sold six or seven thanks to tht site (and 3 thanks to S32).